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metaphysics, and keyblades, and lookalikes, Oh My!

Discussion in 'General Kingdom Hearts' started by TheKnightofAwesome, Jun 1, 2011.

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  1. Jun 1, 2011 #1
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

    so a couple things that I don't get about the KH universe is Why do so many people have Keyblades? I mean In KH1 everyone talks about it like it's the ultimate weapon and only one "chosen one" can wield it. but nowadays it's like anyone can just go to their local market and get one. seriously! and i know it's somewhat explained by that the keyblade is an extention of one's heart and all, but what ever happened to consistency? another thing is why do Sora and Ventus have so many lookalike forms? I mean Vanitus looks like Sora (with Black hair), Roxas looks just like Ventus. My theory is that at the beginning of BBS, when Ven and Sora "meet" inside Ven's heart they became connected and thus their destinies became intertwined. as a result Ven's "Dark-half" and Sora's Nobody look like the other. can anyone support or give evidence against this theory?
     
  2. Jun 1, 2011 #2
    ADogX

    ADogX R.I.P. Captain Unohana

    reasons why there have been more Keyblade Wielders: Probably because since there became so few remaining, people began to believe that only a few "chosen" can wield the Keyblade. Thus calling Sora, The Chosen One. (very original huh?)

    Ventus and Sora: Your theory is pretty accurate. I don't know if, in the beginning of the game, it was Sora who became part of Ventus, but at the end of BBS (the secret ending) Ventus' heart fussed with Sora. Ven's heart became lonely and had to find someone with a heart of pure light, thus finding Sora. Since Ven's heart was in Sora, that's why Roxas looks exactly like Ventus.
     
  3. Jun 1, 2011 #3
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

    that still doesn't explain why Vanitus looks like Sora. And I'm fairly certain that it was Sora who let Ven borrow some of his heart at the beginning of BBS (on Destiny Islands).
     
  4. Jun 1, 2011 #4
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    Name 5 current wielders!

    That's just one world there could be many wielders that they do not know about!
    If that was true. Maleficent would have one.

    Seems legit to me that in other worlds there are other wielders.

    Sora supplemented the damage parts of Ventus heart. So Vanitas appearance became Sora's appearance. Hypothetically if Riku supplemented Ventus's heart. Vanitas would appear as Riku.

    I did in bold, above. Also Ventus's heart lies within Sora in a sleep state. It is implied that Roxas has a heart. Ventus's heart went into Roxas when Sora struck himself with the Keyblade of People's Heart. As a result of having Ventus's heart. Roxas appears as Ventus.

    Sora reached out to Ventus. Plus Sora does not have a heart of pure light.

    Kairi's heart was also in Sora but Roxas does not look like Kairi. Ventus's heart went into Roxas.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2011
  5. Jun 1, 2011 #5
    Kit

    Kit New Member

    Sora, Data Sora, Aqua, Riku, Mickey, Roxas. That makes 6. Other than that, I agree with everything in your post.
     
  6. Jun 1, 2011 #6
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    Data Sora, Aqua, and Roxas do not exist! XD

    So you have 3.
     
  7. Jun 1, 2011 #7
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

    Um I may be wrong about this...But I'm pretty sure that Aqua exists...she just exists in the realm of Darkness (at least until Sora and Riku rescue her).

    You also say that Roxas has Ventus' heart. So wouldn't that mean that he technically exists too? I mean Nobody's don't exist only because they don't have hearts right?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 1, 2011
  8. Jun 1, 2011 #8
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    The Realm of the Living is The Realm of Light. Aqua no longer dwells in this realm but The Realm of Darkness. She must be born from sleep. Therefore she does not exist until she is born from sleep. -Simplified-Those that aren't in the Realm of Light do not exist!



    Well first of all Nobodies do exist! (Ansem even said they shouldn't exist!) They just say they do not because of the way of their birth. Neither belonging to the Light nor Darkness but being born into Twilight. This is their reason for saying they are non existent. This existence also allows them to travel between realms. Their hearts is significant to this situation. Being stripped of their hearts caused this existence so in order for them to "truly exist" (as in belonging to the Realm of Living) they must regain their hearts and become complete once more.

    As for Roxas he does not exist since he is no longer in the Realm of the Living!
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2011
  9. Jun 2, 2011 #9
    x3pic

    x3pic I'll Kill You.

    For the most part KeybladeLegacy cleared it up..but he's way to nice about it..

    So many people do not have keyblades... 3 people do. Sora, Riku, King Mickey
    as for Ven, Terra, and Aqua. That was 11 years ago (KH time). So keyblades where more common back then. (not super common, but more common then in current KH time)

    I
    Right, the keyblade chooses its master. Sense in present time there are not alot of keyblades. (only 3) the keyblades that do exist chose their master. Example: In KH1, the keyblade chose Riku, but after seeing that riku wasn't fit enough for it, it returned to Sora, choosing him as its new master.
    !
    KH2 Jack Sparrow wanted one..couldn't have it.





    Sora, Wisdom Form Sora, Valor form Sora, Master Form Sora, Final Form Sora :) jk






    Thus Namine was born

    -_______-
    Sora and Data Sora are the same

    Roxas..and sora.....are the....same

    Riku

    King....

    Aqua....-_- is lost..FOEVA
     
  10. Jun 2, 2011 #10
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    Yup that's how I approach things.


    Obviously what was I thinking! O_O

    Si

    Si

    And why not!
    Yup I remember
    Yes!
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I beg to differ.
    Extract - to obtain something from a source, usually by separating it out from other material.
    The Keyblade of Hearts which Sora used on himself. He extracted his heart (the source) and Kairi's heart leaving behind Ven's heart and his body (other material). For bonus support, I like to mention that Roxas's has emotions, his appearance looks like Ven's and is said to have a heart. Last but not least I would like to go by Nomura's hint.
    I rest my case!
     
  11. Jun 2, 2011 #11
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

     
  12. Jun 2, 2011 #12
    x3pic

    x3pic I'll Kill You.

    Lets go.
    good...

    Perhaps- Used to express uncertainty or possibility!

    so in other words. Nomura is using it as a mystery, maybe Roxas does, maybe he doesn't got it?
    Now sense its not CONFIRMED. We can't say Roxas has Ven's heart.
    On the other note, Ven's and Sora's Heart fused as ONE, meaning there is only one heart living in sora, some parts that are Sora's and Others that are Ven's. he doesn't have Ven's heart in him sepertaly. Or else he would have Ven's memories.. He doesn't. Thats why I say its impossible fro Roxas to have Ven's heart. He may get his looks from Ven and get emotions because of it, but Roxas doesn't have a heart. He wouldn't be considered a nobody at that.

    So, the true answer to this question is, We do not know if Roxas has a heart or not. Only Nomura can say yes or no. So until then I'm going with he doesn't because of what he is classified as.. A nobody
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2011
  13. Jun 2, 2011 #13
    ADogX

    ADogX R.I.P. Captain Unohana

    Well about that, Master Xehanort said that a Keyblade War went on in that graveyard. If you can tell, my Keyblade Wielders were killed there. Thus making Keyblade Wielders uncommon and very rare. I think more information will be announced in KH3
     
  14. Jun 2, 2011 #14
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

    We can only hope so. a series just gets boring after a while if it doesn't evolve and explain itself while adding new aspects to itself in the process. That's why I love KH, It's always changing and adding new things.
     
  15. Jun 3, 2011 #15
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    Bring it!

    Hence I called it a hint and bold it.

    Neither can we deny it.

    Come to think about it. I don't ever remember Sora or Ventus saying anything about being part of Sora's heart during the end.

    Ven: You gave me something back when I needed it most. A second chance.

    Sora: I did?

    Ven: But...now I have to go back to sleep again.

    Sora: Are you sad?

    Ven: Would you mind if I stayed here, with you?

    Sora: Sure, if it'll make you feel better.

    Ven: Thank you.


    Well not necessarily true since Sora didn't have Kairi's memories except about her Grandmother. Ventus's heart is "in sleep" and was damaged. I doubt Sora would have his memories after what happened to it and the fact that he didn't have Kairi's.

    What is a nobody? A body and soul that has lost it's heart containing a strong will. Roxas is a SPECIAL Nobody. The fact is Roxas was born the way all nobodies are born. If Roxas had a heart but was born as a Nobody; No one would have the slightest idea! So considering him a Nobody is not unreasonable. Namine is also "considered" a Nobody but her existence is beyond me. Having no body or soul and also being born from a Heart of Pure Light. Namine and Roxas are truly exceptions to the rule of whatever a Nobody is.

    As for now I'm for just the opposite. Ansem classified them as Special and Exceptions to the rules. Clearly having a heart is an exception (As if Ansem would know). Xemnas as well. (is an exception).
     
    Answer Man likes this.
  16. Jun 3, 2011 #16
    x3pic

    x3pic I'll Kill You.

    A good opponent you are. But I believe we have come to a stand still.
    Your taking it as a hint, I'm taking it as Nomura being Nomura and trying to throw more questions and mystery into the game. Like he always does.


    Yea, but it is said that Ven's heart went, Within sora's heart. Meaning into, which I'm taking as fused. He didn't say it went within sora's body or that would be totally different.

    Atleast it was some sign of memory.
    Xion had memories of Sora, because her "artifical" heart was actually from sora.
    Sora had memories of Kairi, because he actually had Kairi's heart

    That is true, yet the both were born in a SPECIAL way. I got that. It doesn't stop them from being nobodies.
    And i'm on the other side. Hopefully someday we can get the answer.
     
  17. Jun 3, 2011 #17
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

    Here's another thing that confuses me. I once heard someone talk about an "artificial" Kingdom Hearts. Does that really exist in one of the games, and how is it different from the real Kingdom Hearts?
     
  18. Jun 3, 2011 #18
    Angel

    Angel Lion Heart Staff Member Administrator

    Kingdom Hearts 2 had the Kingdom Hearts of All Men brought about forcefully and artificially by collecting hearts. So you can kinda call it artificial but it's the "real deal"

    You as well. I see.
    I can agree with that.

    Eh...guess it makes sense. Sora heart did become a part of Ventus's heart on Destiny Islands (the beginning of the game). And it was probably Ventus talking to Sora in Dive to the Heart in KH 1.

    True.

    But Xion's memories came from Roxas. Xion took memories and Roxas's abilities.

    Then, we can settle this impasse.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2011
  19. Jun 3, 2011 #19
    x3pic

    x3pic I'll Kill You.

    Correction, Xion is not a nobody as you should know. She is a replica, meaning she has a fake heart. A heart is made of a whole bunch of memories. Most of her, if not all of her heart is Sora's, remember Xion is made from memories basically. If you have memories and emotion inside you then you have what makes a heart. When Sora's memories scattered everywhere, you can sorta say his heart was ripped out of his chest. Then Xion started to pick up the pieces through Roxas, which she started rebuilding Sora's heart inside her self. Through those memories, her own natural replica ability was able to replicate the missing parts of Sora's heart she didn't have and the power to use Sora's keyblade.

    basically what im saying, Xion's heart is quite litterally Sora's heart.
     
  20. Jun 3, 2011 #20
    TheKnightofAwesome

    TheKnightofAwesome ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼

     
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